RTS FANS! The US Gov. is building fucking skynet! :D

[Karmashock]

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/13/technology/13warnet.html?ei=5065&en=2f2db551a15fe3af&ex=1101013200&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print&position=

well... not really... it seems like the idea is to actually turn all of hte varied and diverse intellegence into one giant interactive graphical database... not unlike what we tend to interact with in our games...


The concept has been around for awhile, but the execution will be amazing. :D

[Karmashock]

out of fucking control :D
http://newsmax.com/images/headlines/DoDInternet-1.jpg

[JADezimar]

Eh ive alwayz dreamed of A game where it was like virtual reality and what I did actually happened in game like for instance if I crawled up in a ball and hid in corner it should show me doing that =x

[shutupandshave]

I give it a week before some 12 yr old Korean hacks into it, and starts posting secrets on the internet.

[MVB]

I love how idiotic you think Americans are. The fact that no one hacked ArpaNet the entire time it existed due to the fact that no one could access it doesn't ring a bell at all.

This system won't be in any way shape or form connected to the internet. Some 12 year old Korean won't have any way to tap into it. Instead of taking advantage of the WWW, it'll be entirely separate from it.

[shutupandshave]

Woah there Captain Presumptious - it has nothing to do with Americans.
I think a 12 yr old Korean would hack into it no matter who made it.

If an army soldier can access it, then a 12 yr old Korean with a science kit can. You'll still have encrypted data being broadcast by satellite (or however they plan to do this) - put it this way - I think it will be easier to get around than the enigma machines were.

[Karmashock]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA

[MVB]

You need a receiver; namely the equipment only members of the US military will have. Nobody illegaly accessed ArpaNet the entire time it existed, for over 30 years, and that was the same concept.

[Ummon]

Probably not, I can imagine at least 3 or 4 fail-safe mathematical methods to make it hack-resistant. The fact is, all hardware for this system is of homogeneous origin, so you can add encryption keys directly in the equipement, for example. That's what most weapon industries already do. When equipement goes missing, you simply disable the related keys.

EDIT: my reply to suas has come late and is redundant.

[JADezimar]

I play plenty of games with Asian kids Koreans etc etc. Ya they generally are a little bit more Technologically inclined on the average. But... There not as brilliant as you think they are. The states top researchers etc are just as good as anyone elses top. Why hell the uk's top are as good as any other top. You overestimate the Asian mind with technology. There just like any other nations ppl. If they were so brilliant and inclined wouldnt you think there militaries would be far more advanced o0. If I remember right Japan or korea in any war has not had more advanced tech ? correct.

[shutupandshave]

Sorry MVB, there is no way you know for sure that no one ever hacked into arpanet. Do you think it's information that would be publically released? If they hacked in WELL, there would be no trace of them being there.

It may be that Arpa was not hacked...but it is just as likely it was...in addition, it seems that Arpa closed in 1977 - before anyone really had access to any kind of networking experience....

[MVB]

Arpa never actually "closed," per se; it simply became over time a publically accessible network.

Anyway, I find the concept of this system being hacked or even hackable to be totally ridiculous, and find it humorous that you would perpetuate the "it's possible" theory. It's also POSSIBLE that a 12 year old Korean might infiltrate MI headquarters in Britain, and single-handedly kill off everyone there, using nothing but a clothes pin. It's just not highly likely, or feasible.

[vacio]

However MvB, this is technology. I'm not saying a 12 year old korean could do it, but their is always someone smarter than the system, so it is possible to break it. Always. . .that's computer ethics 101. . . .

[MVB]

Vacio, no one can hack my Microwave. It has a computer on board, but it is not accessible unless you're AT the microwave, because the internet -- and therefore a 12 year old Korean's computer -- is not in any way connected to it. I totally agree that it's "possible" to break codes and firewalls and system securities, but without access, you can't do anything. The military is not using the existing world wide web or internet pathways, or even the current satellites to access any of this stuff. It's all a closed circuit system, only accessible by the appropriate gear, which won't be available to the average individual, in any way shape or form, and which I'm sure will have a bajillion failsafes to prevent someone who gets ahold of said technology from even turning it on.

[Mistress Crystal]

lol Relax MVB.

Your ego never lets anyone crack a joke. ;)

... unless it's you, of course.

[MVB]

Relax? NEVAR!

[vacio]

Vacio, no one can hack my Microwave. It has a computer on board, but it is not accessible unless you're AT the microwave, because the internet -- and therefore a 12 year old Korean's computer -- is not in any way connected to it. I totally agree that it's "possible" to break codes and firewalls and system securities, but without access, you can't do anything. The military is not using the existing world wide web or internet pathways, or even the current satellites to access any of this stuff. It's all a closed circuit system, only accessible by the appropriate gear, which won't be available to the average individual, in any way shape or form, and which I'm sure will have a bajillion failsafes to prevent someone who gets ahold of said technology from even turning it on.

Not once did i say anything about your microwave, nor did I say anything about how the system itself is setup. Stop jumping at me MvB. I will repeat what I said b/c I guess you didn't get it the first time.

It is still just technology, and their is always someone smarter than the person who made it, thus it can be hacked. I don't care if you have to break through Area 51 to stand on-site to do it, their is a way. Never did I refute what you had said. I was just making the statement that all technology can be hacked. If you can get to it or not in order to hack it. . .well, that's not my business.

[MVB]

*jumps at Vacio*

[vacio]

wow, he does have a sense of humor after all

[Karmashock]

hackers only break weak systems... and even then they tend to rely on social engineering...


Anyway, fuck that tangent... the CONCEPT of this thing is neat... The next person to bring up hacking this thing has no penis... focus on what matters... digitizing all the battlefield intelligence and networking it so that commanders and field soldiers can access it in real time... seriously cool... I mean... you could jack into a predator drone to see over the next hill... send pictures to an air craft carrier for target evaluation and get a graphical response in minutes... or hell... seconds...

this whole thing is going to revolutionize modern warfare.


Just think about the possibilities...


you might even be able to take temperorary control of an unmanned craft... tanks or planes...

[shutupandshave]

MVB, we'll have to agree to disagree here - only time will tell.

Bear in mind though, that I feel I have a reasonable understanding of 1) encryption technologies, and 2) the way that information is broadcast and 3) the way networks (whether private or public) work.

You have, many many times referred to the fact you have NO idea what you're talking about when it comes to most of this stuff.

[MVB]

I'll admit that I'm not computer savvy; as a result, I am speaking out of my element. We'll leave it as a) you're more qualified to talk about it, and b) I doubt it'll be busted through anyway, as well as a smidgeon of what you allude to -- c) time will tell.

[shutupandshave]

I think you're probably right on how difficult it will be too crack. Very.

I still think it'll happen, and yes - time will tell (although probably not us)

[JADezimar]

Hmmmz Someone that badly wnats to hack and decides to steal Us technology, basically a spy that steals nuclear technology might get it. But I still dont c how you can be some average joe just hacking into a microwave I got a good laugh at that comparison and analogy and it makes complete sense to me.

[shutupandshave]

Well JAD, I will attempt to explain this - and try and do a good job,

Firstly - regarding the microwave analogy.
If I attached a device that monitored and intercepted the key presses from the microwave, I could "hack" it. I could alter it's program, and I could turn it on and off whenever I pleased. I thought that was pretty obvious so I didn't point it out.

Hacking into the new net:
The simplest method would be to shoot a US soldier when he was already logged in. That would mean you could pick up the "laptop" and access it. If it's two way, then you may be able to drop a trojan in there. The US government CAN NOT defend against all kinds of virii/trojans if a hacker has access to the network already. This is not EASY to do, but if there is a full scale conflict in which this technology is used - I imagine it reasonably likely that at some points the US enemies would, at least momentarily gain access to this network.
To be able to use - what are essentially wireless devices - a signal needs to be transmitted to the user (say a US soldier). This signal is not transmitted via a tight beam sub-space signal. It's broadcast over a very large area. Anyone with the correct receiving equipment AND decryption key will be able to get in. Receiving equipment would be relatively simple for anyone determined - getting the key would be very tough.

Almost every cryptology expert has always said that no cryptology could ever be 100% secure. EVER. Assuming the key was a password type device - it could be found out various different methods - from using a telescope to observe someone putting THEIR key in - to bruce forcing it.

[JADezimar]

And thats what I stated in my posts so in ways were in aggreement........ But then again in your lasts posts you finally admitting a 12 yr old korean wont easily do it? But you proved my point about having to be there and on the spot to hack mvb's microwave.

[shutupandshave]

You dont have to be there to hack it. You have to have been there at some point... but that's a whole different thing to having to be there to operate the microwave.

[JADezimar]

ya you have to be there at some point. When in hell is the 12 yr old korean kid gonna be at skynet. ? Or get ahold of a dead soldiers machine and have the means and know how to use it and hack it?

[shutupandshave]

Jad - you said in the post before this - that you realised that a 12 yr old wouldn't be the one doing it... why are you bringing it up again?

[JADezimar]

cuase that was my whole piont the entire time o0 for you to admitt a 12 yr old wouldnt be doing it. Not for me to admitt it or any joe smoe for that matter.


Edit K lets move on o0 Discussing a 12 yr old korean kid is becoming comical :p

[shutupandshave]

I admitted that a while ago - lets move on?

[Mistress Crystal]

I count 3 people that don't have penises.

[MVB]

I'll admit that I'm not computer savvy; as a result, I am speaking out of my element. We'll leave it as a) you're more qualified to talk about it, and b) I doubt it'll be busted through anyway, as well as a smidgeon of what you allude to -- c) time will tell.


-- We'll leave it --

[vacio]

I count 3 people that don't have penises.


Don't think any of them really care. It is a valid subject for this though. If they made it and it is compromised, we lose a big stratagic imperative.

[MVB]

But if I don't have a penis, I lose a big personal imperative.

[JADezimar]

lol

[shutupandshave]

I count 3 people that don't have penises.
I think counting penis's is a very odd job.

[Karmashock]

not if you're a girl... then knowing a guy has at least one penis is kind of important... :D