Sternguard Question

[Hawtogre]

Does the rule for multiple ammunition work for the Sternguard while they are using their bolt pistols and/or stormbolters? From what I read it is only viable when they are using their bolters. If so why give them 2 attacks each while making a unit made for melee like an assault squad only recieve 1? I am very new to fifth edition, (2 games under my belt) just a little confused by the SM book lol.

[MVB]

Veterans are veterans are veterans. 2 attacks instead of 1 is their only statistical difference from regular space marines.


When you think about it, it's an excellent, excellent addition to Sternguard. It's what makes them so ridiculously overpowered. They're a close range unit. Anyone sitting sternies still or not transporting them and shooting only once at 24" is a retard.

Sternies get within 12" of the enemy, and fire double-tapped super nasty special ammo. You never ever ever ever ever use the "gets hot!" ammo, b/c it will self gank.

Then, if you get charged, and if you're using Sternguard "competitively," you've got Pedro Kantor there, and so they're a ridiculously powerful super shooty unit that happens to have 3 attacks per model if you're dumb enough to charge them, they count as scoring and oh by the way they're stubborn.


Without Pedro, they drop drastically in effectiveness, losing stubborn and the extra attack, and no longer scoring. In fact, w/out Pedro, they actually suddenly "suck," being just another non-scoring easy-kill Elite unit with a couple of close combat attacks and a nasty punch before they die.

[Hawtogre]

Thanks for the clarification Mike. I think it is pretty sad that there are unit selections that are pointless in playing if they are not played in a certain way in or with a specific combo. It is prolly the biggest reason that I have always put 40k on the same strategic level as chutes and ladders. :D The game has always leaned towards a rock, paper, scissors mentality with cookie cutter lists. I will try this game because I want to play against friends in this league. The game has one summer to impress me or this army can meet the same fate as my previous army did for all I care... melt in a house fire

[Waffle]

You just have to laugh at mike.....what a tard. All that bantering about "how to" and "when" Sterngaurd will suck and he doesn't even answer your original question. But that ok, al long as mike thinks he plays for fun we are will all be fooled by his "non-competitive" commentary.

Lee wrote Does the rule for multiple ammunition work for the Sternguard while they are using their bolt pistols and/or stormbolters?"

The answer is that it only works with a bolter, so storm bolters and bolt pistols don't gain the special ammo rule. Although combi-bolter weapons do as they are bolters themselves with a combi-weapon add on.
~Brian

[MVB]

It's not cookie cutter, Lee. Throughout the game, throughout the codices, there are "neat" force multipliers. Sternguard are good units either way, in a statistical/Ikillshit sense, but you have to let more competitive mindsets be more competitive, a la Billy/me/etc.

Same goes for Sayman.

Sternguard have a phenomenal force multiplier in Pedro, so much so that if your mind is simply the way mine is, you're more likely to go WOW DO THAT.

IT doesn't make it the be-all / end-all.

As for the statline, you're getting 2 attacks on assault marines, plus jump packs, and they cost less points. Balances out.


As for Sayman, you need to stop highlighting how douchey the "don't think competitively" mindset people are. People already get it, so stop pretending to be one.




Also, as an aside, there's absolutely nothing rock/paper/scissors about 40k. Application of firepower, streamlined list design (instead of the "GIANT BLOCK OF DOOM W/ A HERO" in fantasy) and excessive foresight are the big three. Foresight is the "biggest." What I mean by that is in 40k there are TONS of ways to move "out" of a trap ... enough that your tactics have to be incredibly sound to truly "trap" a skilled opponent. Other than things like the Lash of Submission, there are no ways to force your opponent to go where you want him to or drastically limit his movement options like there are in Fantasy. As a result, you are faced with a much tougher task getting him into a position where NO move against you is a "good" one. There's nothing rock paper scissors about it. Plasmaguns killing armor 2+ saves may be rock paper scissors, but the meta-game of 40k is where the game is won or lost.

IN other words, hitting one of my nails with a big fucking hammer is cool, in the sense that it's fun to watch. Hitting all of my nails with big ENOUGH hammers all at the same time, though, and forcing me to have no choice but to leave the nails right where you want them? Now that's freakin' awesome to watch also, and it's really good gamin'.

[MVB]

PS - Sayman, <3

[Darwinn69]

It's not rock, paper, scissors....but don't let Mike fool you into thinking this is some highly stratigic game. He's just showing his ignorance of Fantasy. The thing to remember between the two systems: Fantasy is won or lost in the movement phase...40k is won or lost in the list building phase.

[MVB]

I disagree w/ both. Your ork list beats me every time if it's only the list building phase :)


Also, I'm not so much ignorant of fantasy, as I am a non-player.

And it's "strategic."

I've resorted to the lowly tactic of refuting an argument by targetting spelling and/or grammar.